[RocketsNW] Aerotech Announces Surcharge

Thu Jun 25 15:04:23 PDT 2009

Hello to a fellow Jack!

As to working for CTI's marketing department, hey if the pay is good...? :-)

Actually, they probably wouldn't have liked that I mentioned that only the Classic reload would work in a cross hardware situation.? According to their FAQ on the website, the White Thunder load for the 75-4G would also work for the 75/5120.

And I certainly wouldn't dump my Aerotech hardware if I can get a CTI reload that would work with that hardware, too.? That way, I have more options on propellant open to me.

Jack C.

-----Original Message-----
From: Jack Anderson <jackanderson98012 at hotmail.com>
To: rockets at rocketsnw.com; jjcllc03 at aol.com
Sent: Thu, Jun 25, 2009 1:59 pm
Subject: Re: [RocketsNW] Aerotech Announces Surcharge

Man, you should go to work for CTI in their marketing department. I am already to put my Aerotech hardware on eBay and start over with CTI.?
?
--------------------------------------------------?
From: <jjcllc03 at aol.com>?
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 10:40 AM?
To: <rockets at rocketsnw.com>?
Subject: Re: [RocketsNW] Aerotech Announces Surcharge?
?
> No, I think Gary didn't plan well and this is the result of his not > planning well.? Gary had been buying surplus AP rather than the fresh AP > that CTI uses and the surplus AP source began to dry up.? He could have > arranged to replace this source with Chinese or Russian AP but he probably > believes it would be costly and time consuming to arrange for all the > permits and paperwork required to buy from foreign sources.? So instead of > raising his prices for his products across the board, he decided to use a > surcharge against the dealers either hoping the dealers would bear the > brunt of angrying the consumer by passing the cost along or that the > dealers would eat the surcharge.? He did not plan for the consumers to > hear about the surcharge...the notice was sent to dealers by Aerotech not > to consumer sources like Rocketry Planet.?
>?
> As for favorite motors and all, I did a quick check.? To buy the AT > 75/5120 system (the casing and all closures) one dealer is charging about > $550.? The CTI system for a similar sized reload (75 4G) is around $306.? > The CTI system is 45% cheaper than the AT system.? As for the reloads, the > AT reload for this case would be $280 while the CTI reload is $247.? So > you save $33 on the CTI reload and you can use the CTI classic load in the > AT 75/5120 system.? Soon, CTI will have 5 or 6 different reloads with > similar characteristics to the AT propellant for the 4G system.??
>?
> So if you had no hardware to start with and wanted to move up, CTI gear in > the bigger sizes appears to be more cost-effective.? If you have AT > hardware already, I would concede that CTI reloads for AT hardware is > somewhat viable but limited (for instance, although the classic load > will?work in the AT hardware, the White Lightning reload won't).?
>?
> -----Original Message-----?
> From: Paul Bogdanich <jhadv at pacifier.com>?
> To: rockets at rocketsnw.com?
> Sent: Thu, Jun 25, 2009 7:58 am?
> Subject: Re: [RocketsNW] Aerotech Announces Surcharge?
>?
>?
>?
> Speaking just for myself I think AeroTech was being honest when they said?
> the problem was getting a "reliable" consistent "quality" supply of?
> AP. When making things like this the consistency of the base materials is?
> paramount if one wants repeatable performance metrics. I suspect what?
> happened is he used to be close to first in line for shuttle excess but > now?
> that the shuttle is going away that supply is no longer sufficient to meet?
> motor demand. So he needs to find new supply. With respect to Cessaroni?
> it's easier to buy bulk chemical of any sort in Canada than in?
> America. Period. For example I bet the Russians make a lot of good,?
> consistent, highest quality, low price AP. Try and buy some in America > and?
> see what happens to you. In Canada much fewer problems. Lower cost of?
> materials, same cost of labor, no disguised taxes in the form of health?
> care policies and so on. It's just plain hard to manufacture anything in?
> the US anymore on any kind of industrial scale. The basic legal framework?
> doesn't allow it. As to AeroTech being diminished I doubt it. People,?
> including me, have favorite motors for certain rockets. I don't think an?
> extra 5 to 50 dollars per motor is going to change my motor?
> selection. However if the performance from one round to the next started?
> to change than would change my motor selection. Predictable, reliable?
> performance is the first order of business. In my opinion.?
>?
> _______________________________________________?
> Rockets mailing list?
> Rockets at rocketsnw.com?
> http://mx1.blastzone.com/mailman/listinfo/rockets?
>?
>?
>?
?
?
> _______________________________________________?
> Rockets mailing list?
> Rockets at rocketsnw.com?
> http://mx1.blastzone.com/mailman/listinfo/rockets?
> 
-------------- next part --------------
As to working for CTI's marketing department, hey if the pay is good...  :-)
Actually, they probably wouldn't have liked that I mentioned that only the Classic reload would work in a cross hardware situation.  According to their FAQ on the website, the White Thunder load for the 75-4G would also work for the 75/5120.
And I certainly wouldn't dump my Aerotech hardware if I can get a CTI reload that would work with that hardware, too.  That way, I have more options on propellant open to me.
Jack C.
-----Original Message-----
From: Jack Anderson <jackanderson98012 at hotmail.com>
To: rockets at rocketsnw.com; jjcllc03 at aol.com
Sent: Thu, Jun 25, 2009 1:59 pm
Subject: Re: [RocketsNW] Aerotech Announces Surcharge
Man, you should go to work for CTI in their marketing department. I am already to put my Aerotech hardware on eBay and start over with CTI. 

-------------------------------------------------- 
From: < [A] jjcllc03 at aol.com
> 
Sent: Thursday, June 25, 2009 10:40 AM 
To: < [A] rockets at rocketsnw.com
> 
Subject: Re: [RocketsNW] Aerotech Announces Surcharge 

> No, I think Gary didn't plan well and this is the result of his not > planning well.? Gary had been buying surplus AP rather than the fresh AP > that CTI uses and the surplus AP source began to dry up.? He could have > arranged to replace this source with Chinese or Russian AP but he probably > believes it would be costly and time consuming to arrange for all the > permits and paperwork required to buy from foreign sources.? So instead of > raising his prices for his products across the board, he decided to use a > surcharge against the dealers either hoping the dealers would bear the > brunt of angrying the consumer by passing the cost along or that the > dealers would eat the surcharge.? He did not plan for the consumers to > hear about the surcharge...the notice was sent to dealers by Aerotech not > to consumer sources like Rocketry Planet. 
> 
> As for favorite motors and all, I did a quick check.? To buy the AT > 75/5120 system (the casing and all closures) one dealer is charging about > $550.? The CTI system for a similar sized reload (75 4G) is around $306.? > The CTI system is 45% cheaper than the AT system.? As for the reloads, the > AT reload for this case would be $280 while the CTI reload is $247.? So > you save $33 on the CTI reload and you can use the CTI classic load in the > AT 75/5120 system.? Soon, CTI will have 5 or 6 different reloads with > similar characteristics to the AT propellant for the 4G system.? 
> 
> So if you had no hardware to start with and wanted to move up, CTI gear in > the bigger sizes appears to be more cost-effective.? If you have AT > hardware already, I would concede that CTI reloads for AT hardware is > somewhat viable but limited (for instance, although the classic load > will?work in the AT hardware, the White Lightning reload won't). 
> 
> -----Original Message----- 
> From: Paul Bogdanich < [A] jhadv at pacifier.com
> 
> To: [A] rockets at rocketsnw.com

> Sent: Thu, Jun 25, 2009 7:58 am 
> Subject: Re: [RocketsNW] Aerotech Announces Surcharge 
> 
> 
> 
> Speaking just for myself I think AeroTech was being honest when they said 
> the problem was getting a "reliable" consistent "quality" supply of 
> AP. When making things like this the consistency of the base materials is 
> paramount if one wants repeatable performance metrics. I suspect what 
> happened is he used to be close to first in line for shuttle excess but > now 
> that the shuttle is going away that supply is no longer sufficient to meet 
> motor demand. So he needs to find new supply. With respect to Cessaroni 
> it's easier to buy bulk chemical of any sort in Canada than in 
> America. Period. For example I bet the Russians make a lot of good, 
> consistent, highest quality, low price AP. Try and buy some in America > and 
> see what happens to you. In Canada much fewer problems. Lower cost of 
> materials, same cost of labor, no disguised taxes in the form of health 
> care policies and so on. It's just plain hard to manufacture anything in 
> the US anymore on any kind of industrial scale. The basic legal framework 
> doesn't allow it. As to AeroTech being diminished I doubt it. People, 
> including me, have favorite motors for certain rockets. I don't think an 
> extra 5 to 50 dollars per motor is going to change my motor 
> selection. However if the performance from one round to the next started 
> to change than would change my motor selection. Predictable, reliable 
> performance is the first order of business. In my opinion. 
> 
> _______________________________________________ 
> Rockets mailing list 
> [A] Rockets at rocketsnw.com

> [A] http://mx1.blastzone.com/mailman/listinfo/rockets

> 
> 
> 

> _______________________________________________ 
> Rockets mailing list 
> [A] Rockets at rocketsnw.com

> [A] http://mx1.blastzone.com/mailman/listinfo/rockets

>
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